[NeilP]

Note to Gove and indeed all Politicians.

We deserve better than the shit you serve us every day of every week of every year. You are a total disgrace, you are both morally and financially corrupt and act like spoilt children.

Take a look in the mirror and realize that rather than talk about something that really affects nobody and look at the massive negative affects you have on the whole of society in the UK and indeed beyond.

STFU

[PapaofGags]

Note to Gove and indeed all Politicians.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFgAllmI6LY  (1m 14s)   

[morini]

Grenfell fire: Backlash against Mercedes F1 team over tower insulation firm sponsorship

https://news.sky.com/story/backlash-agai...p-12485104

Yeah, we all read about it and I'm far more disgusted about the media "reporters" than I am about an attack on a mostly innocent firm who have simply supplied insulation materials to the market. Basically, there's nothing the British public like more than a pitchfork assault to make people feel better about a terrible tragedy. Make your own minds up, but I'm not prepared to jump on that (particularly stupid) bandwagon. This Irish firm (who are getting all the very undeserved flak) do nothing more than manufacture an insulation product. They do not mandate where that insulation product should and should not be used. It is up to the architects / developers /project managers who are using the product to decide whether that product is suitable for the use case. Besides, if the (shitehawk) media reports are correct this insulation was 5% of the cladding used at Grenfell. Somebody should be hauled over the coals for the Grenfell tragedy, for sure, but I'm reckoning it isn't Kingspan. Go after the correct target.

Some media outlets were actually having a go at Lewis Hamilton over this one. FFS, get a grip. Like the man has any influence over who Mercedes choose as team sponsors! Sometimes I worry that other humans are incapable of rational thought. 

In a true PR sense, then yeah, maybe Mercedes AMG should have steered clear of this particular sponsorship deal due to the sensitivity. If I am honest, the people I feel for most in this latest "media outrage" are the employees of Kingspan.

---

I saw Toto Wolff's response and thought it worth adding here. Moderate, measured and appropriate IMO. 

   

[morini]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFgAllmI6LY  (1m 14s)   

Yep, Boris certainly is.

Gotta say, he doesn't deserve a song written about him though. I wouldn't give the bumbling arsehole the satisfaction!

[forzaferrari]

Yeah, we all read about it and I'm far more disgusted about the media "reporters" than I am about an attack on a mostly innocent firm who have simply supplied insulation materials to the market. Basically, there's nothing the British public like more than a pitchfork assault to make people feel better about a terrible tragedy. Make your own minds up, but I'm not prepared to jump on that (particularly stupid) bandwagon. This Irish firm (who are getting all the very undeserved flak) do nothing more than manufacture an insulation product. They do not mandate where that insulation product should and should not be used. It is up to the architects / developers /project managers who are using the product to decide whether that product is suitable for the use case. Besides, if the (shitehawk) media reports are correct this insulation was 5% of the cladding used at Grenfell. Somebody should be hauled over the coals for the Grenfell tragedy, for sure, but I'm reckoning it isn't Kingspan. Go after the correct target.

Some media outlets were actually having a go at Lewis Hamilton over this one. FFS, get a grip. Like the man has any influence over who Mercedes choose as team sponsors! Sometimes I worry that other humans are incapable of rational thought. 

In a true PR sense, then yeah, maybe Mercedes AMG should have steered clear of this particular sponsorship deal due to the sensitivity. If I am honest, the people I feel for most in this latest "media outrage" are the employees of Kingspan.

The problem is (depending on who you believe) Kingspan may not have been a "mostly innocent firm who simply supplied materials"......hence the huge inquiry and the ongoing upset of people who sadly lost loved ones in the tragedy 

BBC:
A company that made insulation used on Grenfell Tower was "stretching the truth" by claiming its product was appropriate for use on high-rise buildings, a former employee has said.
Kingspan fire-tested its cladding product in 2005, but changed the insulation's formulation the next year.
The new version of the product failed to repeat the same performance.
Ex-technical director Ivor Meredith told the inquiry into the fire this was "common knowledge" at Kingspan.
The first phase of the Grenfell inquiry concluded that cladding put on the west London tower block during its refurbishment fuelled the fire in June 2017 in which 72 people died.

Mr Meredith described a fire test using the new version of Kingspan's K15 in 2007 as a "raging inferno", with the insulation "burning on its own steam".
He told the inquiry he was shocked by what he saw.
Despite this, Kingspan continued to use the results from the original 2005 test to sell its material as appropriate for use on high-rise buildings.
Kingspan K15 insulation was used in the flammable cladding system mounted on to Grenfell Tower, alongside Celotex RS5000.

For the record though I do agree this saga has f*ck all to do with Lewis and that Mercedes perhaps should have give this one a swerve, at least until a later date.

[PapaofGags]

Mercedes perhaps should have give this one a swerve, at least until a later date.

Yup, can't see them wanting this in the papers/news every day, "If" the BBC are right & i have no reason to disbelieve they have to kick them into touch.

[morini]

The problem is (depending on who you believe) Kingspan may not have been a "mostly innocent firm who simply supplied materials"......hence the huge inquiry and the ongoing upset of people who sadly lost loved ones in the tragedy 

Mr Meredith described a fire test using the new version of Kingspan's K15 in 2007 as a "raging inferno", with the insulation "burning on its own steam".
He told the inquiry he was shocked by what he saw.
Despite this, Kingspan continued to use the results from the original 2005 test to sell its material as appropriate for use on high-rise buildings.
Kingspan K15 insulation was used in the flammable cladding system mounted on to Grenfell Tower, alongside Celotex RS5000.

For the record though I do agree this saga has f*ck all to do with Lewis and that Mercedes perhaps should have give this one a swerve, at least until a later date.

Not my area of expertise, I fully admit. If Kingspan made false claims about their product then yes, I agree they may well have some deserved pain coming their way down the line. But I'd wait for any inquiry findings to be published before condemning them outright. Besides, the bottom line is the people who put that tower up are solely responsible for ensuring all the materials were fit for purpose. Kingspan may (or may not) have made statements as to the characteristics of their product, but it is up to the developers to test these materials themselves. Claims by the manufacturer simply aren't enough, let me throw in a "due diligence" here (for the record).

It's all "buck passing" in my opinion. The developers are the ones who should be held to account for this tragedy and anything less is a government cover up.

The bit I highlighted in bold I am in 100% agreement with you, by the way. No arguments.

Yup, can't see them wanting this in the papers/news every day, "If" the BBC are right & i have no reason to disbelieve they have to kick them into touch.

Yes, regardless of any perceptions of Kingspan this has to be regarded as a very risky partner venture for Mercedes AMG F1. Their legal team are probably committing hari kari at this very moment!!

[NeilP]

So basically Kingspan are guilty without a trial. I would think Mercedes legal team looked into this pretty closely prior to accepting their money. This world is so full of people getting butt hurt at the wrong people. Look at the power, look at the money trail. That is where the blame lies 99.9% of the time. That said it was probably not a smart idea on their side given the fact the reaction was bound to be hostile.

I know nothing about the cause and circumstances of this fire other than it was a tragic incident that should never have happened but to my untrained mind the most blame and hence responsibility lies with the architects, the construction company and the inspectors who had to sign off on the work.

So tired of all sports taking the blame and backlash for things that are only tangentially connected.

[forzaferrari]

Not for a second am I suggesting Kingspan are guilty of anything, however with the waters muddied and an ongoing investigation I would have thought it wiser to hang fire with any agreements.....and I would say the very same had it been Ferrari.

[NeilP]

Not shooting at you Forza!!!!!