[PapaofGags]

I'll keep Senna out of the conversation because his career was cut tragically short.

Just to clarify I take the piss because Forza's my friend, (& he does the same as he should) like others I have issues with Michael but imo he's up there as one of the greats no question, the ruthless B'stard was born to late he should have been a fighter pilot in WW1.

When he hit Damon in temper I threw a stella tin at my mate's TV, obviously I replaced it, (embarrassed as feck)
but at the time there was a few RRR's & FFF's aimed at ze Red Barron!  

Win only win was his mentality, same as all the WDC's but with a large portion of Dick Dastardly lol. 

As all my mates know I support the Brits but I do respect the greats & Michael imo is one of them.

Sport is all about our favourites, Nigel will always be my favourite, but in truth Senna is the best I've seen.

I've always wondered had Senna Lived would he of had the Ferrari seat?


Any way > #KeepFightingMichael

[forzaferrari]

No contest for me.

One chap is statistically the best of all time, the other is a blatant cheat who didn't care how he won.

I'll keep Senna out of the conversation because his career was cut tragically short.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and while true Lewis has scored more points (overall) than Michael, Toto actually hailed Schumacher as the "Greatest of all time even if statistics would see Lewis in front"

Personally in my opinion there is very little to seperate those who I see as "the greatest", Michael and Ayrton, both had that desire to win at all costs. 
Fans/people are always quick to try and tarnish Michael for what they see as questionable moves/blocks/passes and accidents, however few will compare or cast up those same incidents when it comes to Senna.......Michael and Damon had that infamous coming together in Adelaide but what of Senna`s accident with Prost in Japan.....something Senna later admitted to lying about.....Mosley even having to pen Senna`s confession to enable Senna to keep his points and championship. 
(Likewise no one ever questions Damon intentionally causing a collision with Michael......twice in the season)

Or that time in Spain (think it was 89) when Senna (again) deliberately ignored passing not 1 but 8 black flags, raced flat out past yellow flags at the scene of an accident, then also choose to ignore a red flag.

Like I said from the outset, I see both Senna and Schumacher as the greatest of all time, however Michael will always be my favoured driver....just my opinion. No harm, no foul.

[PapaofGags]

I'll keep Senna out of the conversation because his career was cut tragically short.

Win only win was his mentality, same as all the WDC's but with a large portion of Dick Dastardly lol. 

Sport is all about our favourites, Nigel will always be my favourite, but in truth Senna is the best I've seen.

Personally in my opinion there is very little to seperate those who I see as "the greatest", Michael and Ayrton, both had that desire to win at all costs. 

Fans/people are always quick to try and tarnish Michael for what they see as questionable moves/blocks/passes and accidents, however few will compare or cast up those same incidents when it comes to Senna.......Michael and Damon had that infamous coming together in Adelaide but what of Senna`s accident with Prost in Japan.....something Senna later admitted to lying about.....Mosley even having to pen Senna`s confession to enable Senna to keep his points and championship. 

Like I said from the outset, I see both Senna and Schumacher as the greatest of all time, however Michael will always be my favoured driver....just my opinion. No harm, no foul.

Yeah agree there isn't much between the sports greatest, had they been in each others car imo they would have achieved similar results, most of them had a ruthless streak, I'll come back to this.

I've read some of the drivers of that Senna Schumi era saying that Michael could never understand how Ayrton could get away with what he did yet he was pulled for it, maybe the times had moved on, or maybe it was because he was German lol, but also Ayrton was taken away while Michael was still around so there is still this aura about Senna, I suppose that's why millions of us around the world still see him with rose tinted spectacles, as M once posted "he did have an aura, inside & outside of the car"

As I said above "Sport is all about our favourites"


"I'll come back to this"

Gags wants to add that in his opinion, Fangio, Moss, Clark & Prost whilst having a ruthless streak will still be remembered as gentlemen drivers & thinks they are worth a mention in a greats chat.

(Lets forget for a moment Alain's French )

Most of us were Ayrton Senna fan's but I feel there could be more respect for Alain Prost, if Gags & I remember rightly he had, Lauda, Rosberg, Senna, Mansell & Hill, as team mates, all were or became a WDC.

Only twice Prost was beaten by a team mate for a WDC, Lauda & Senna.

Still French...  

[black]

Everyone is entitled to their opinion

Exactly that. And I've given mine.

Personally in my opinion there is very little to seperate those who I see as "the greatest", Michael and Ayrton, both had that desire to win at all costs. 

Similarly there's little to separate those who I see as "the greatest", Lewis and Ayrton, both had the desire to win at all costs. One even had the desire to win in the right way

Subjective discussion at best, But, to leave Lewis out of "the greatest" list simply because of a dislike of his character is rather ungracious. I'm prepared to accept Schumacher as one of the best the sport has seen, he was a great driver (though always a cheat in my eyes) and I disliked him intensely while he was competing. Shame people don't extend the same courtesy to Lewis Hamilton, but then he's a black lad from a council estate, so it's to be expected.

I wasn't trying to provoke a fight either, my opinion is my opinion (nothing more, nothing less). As you say, no harm no foul. 

Besides, it's a fools mission trying to influence other peoples views on drivers in any case. I have some experience of trying to debate with others regarding Lewis Hamilton's positive impact on Formula 1 (on planet f1). It was totally futile, some people hate him so badly they let emotion colour their logic. So, I gave up and stopped going there after a while.

[NeilP]

Debate is always better than arguing. We are but a small number on here and look at the divergence of opinion. Best ever in anything is tough to decide and in truth its pretty pointless.

My favourite F1 driver of all time is and always will be Nigel Mansell. Best of all time is Senna for me and in truth I cannot give you my reasons. Just like I always say some driver have "it" well Senna had it in bundles. A life tragically cut short and of course I always think of Roland Ratzenburger at the same time as he is often forgotten. Hamilton is statistically the best of all time in many metrics and I for one have no issue with one who thinks he is the best of all time its a fair comment and stance. What upsets me about Hamilton's position in the sport more than anything is the lack of respect and open hostility. This man has never done anything bad on track, certainly not as egregious as either Schumacher or Senna. Yes, he walks a different lifestyle and has lets call it a unique dress sense.  The man always thanks fans win or lose name me another driver who does that? Is it genuine, I think so but there is an element of showmanship of course but even so, he does it. Others do not.

One man who will never be on my list of best is Verstappen. I am not convinced of his credentials. Yes that has time to change but he does not belong in the discussion for great drivers yet alone all timers.

Schumacher is perhaps the most polarizing driver of all time when things are confined to what happens on track. To me he was much more lovable as a Benetton driver than he ever was as a Ferrari driver. Ferrari + Schumacher = The Devil. I think that sums it up perfectly.

Another driver who would quite probably be in the mix even more as the all time F1 driver stakes would be Clark. His tragic death obviously cut short his career which was already monumental. When taking all racing genres into consideration a good case can be made for him being the very best racing driver (all series) of all time.

[PapaofGags]

Five racing drivers we can’t believe never got to drive in Formula 1. (PF1)

While F1 drivers are widely regarded as being the best in the business, some bright lights from other championships never quite got the chance.

Usually, top driving talent in motorsport is spotted by someone, somewhere, who will take the chance on granting some sort of test to see just how good that talent can shine in an F1 car.

But, whether by circumstances or timing, sometimes that talent just slips through the net – only to shine brightly elsewhere. 

Here are our picks for the top five drivers who never got their proper chance in F1.

They (PF1) chose.

Valentino Rossi

Colin McRae/Carlos Sainz

Sebastien Loeb

Tom Kristensen

Dario Franchitti

Wouldn't it of been interesting to see how these guys got on in F1.

I have always believed the top rally guys are amongst the best drivers on the planet, I also think the top bike lads would be epic, though its pretty obvious they could go from bike to car but it would be much harder the other way.